Many of you who have been following me will know that I discourage artists from including dates on their artwork. Recently, I received the following email from the curator of a museum:
Dear Jason,
As a Museum Director, I vehemently disagree with not putting the date created on pieces of work in a portfolio. Why do you suggest that? It appears that the artist is hiding something.Sincerely,
D.R.
I responded:
Dear D,
Thank you for the email and the question. I come at the question from a marketing and sales standpoint, and from my perspective on the front lines of helping artists sell their work, I have only seen the dating of work as a negative.
In a nutshell, here is the problem: It is often the case that a particular work of art will enter the art market and not sell immediately. Sometimes the work is shown in the wrong venue, sometimes the market itself is slow (as over the last several years) and sometimes it’s just poor luck. There are a lot of variables that have to align in order to sell a piece of art. Because of the complexity of the market, an artist will frequently have to move a work of art through several galleries before it finds a home. This process can sometimes take months, or even years. It’s not that there is anything wrong with the artwork, it simply takes time to align the art with the right individual who will be willing and able to make the purchase.
If the work of art includes the creation date we risk prejudicing the potential buyer against the work unnecessarily. The potential buyer may find the artwork to be desirable in every way artistically and aesthetically, and I would argue that the age of the artwork shouldn’t make any difference to this buyer. Unfortunately, I have found age can have an impact on some (not all, but some) buyers.
“I like this piece,” they will say, “but it’s dated 2012. It’s been on the market for over five years and no one has bought it? What’s wrong with it?” This seed of doubt can be enough to dissuade some buyers. I am not speaking hypothetically – I have seen this happen on numerous occasions over my 19 years in the art business, and my experience has lead me to discourage artists from including the date on their work or in their portfolios for this reason. I simply don’t see a compelling reason on the other side of the argument that outweighs this potential risk for an artist who is trying to sell their work in the current art market.
I would argue that it’s not that we’re trying to hide something from potential buyers, but rather that we simply don’t emphasize the age of the work by including the date. If there is no date on the work, in the vast majority of cases, the issue never arises.
I am an impassioned advocate of artists being organized and carefully cataloging all of their work. I encourage artists to make sure that each work of art includes an inventory number which could then be cross-referenced to the artist’s inventory if and when the question of creation date arises in the future.
I understand that from a curatorial standpoint it would be helpful to have easy access to creation date, but the vast majority of artists working today are more concerned with making a living and selling their work. From that perspective, I would argue that, on balance, it is better to avoid overtly dating the work.
I would welcome your perspective and any counter arguments. My position certainly isn’t intractable, I simply want to help artists make informed decisions as they approach the market.
What do you think? Do you include a date on your work? Why or why not? Share your thoughts in the comments below.
I totally agree. I keep very good records and if the need ever arises, I can supply anyone who wishes with the date it was created but I don’t put it on the piece for the very reason you are describing. It’s like asking a women her age. It shouldn’t matter.
Great note, Cindy. Thank you.
I date all of my one-of-a-kind artwork (though not the production pieces). It isn’t on the sales card, or obvious to the casual looker, but it is etched into the metal frame (I’m a glass artist) on the side of my panels. And I have never had anyone ask or question it – though in all fairness I doubt if any of my buyers even notice it.
One other factor to note is the pricing of ALL my artwork regardless of creation date is consistent with my current practices. I once had a big, beautiful, complicated piece that won a few awards but didn’t find a home for almost 10 years. When it sold to just the right collector, the value had more than doubled from when it was created.
Your work is gorgeous, and when it was created wouldn’t matter one bit to me, either. I date my work on the back, and it has helped me many times to have that reminder there. Especially since some of my tiny pieces are numerous and not all titled individually. I no longer put it on the front, (and never had a habit of it anyway). I’ve never had a buyer care when it was made, and sometimes it DID take a long time to find just the right home.
I think that’s an excellent idea Cindy. I agree with Jason and the comments here that it shouldn’t matter, but it does, to the buyer. Putting the date on the back would solve both problems, buyer hesitancy and creation date.
I agree with all of you about keeping records, but not dating the art. Besides, I’ve gone back to some older oils or acrylics and painted over weak spots. Until they sell, repainting is a temptation.
Dating art work may seem advantageous to Museum Directors who like to chronicle various artist’s lives. The convention of dating work does very little for the artist. It is my practice, to place a date on the stretcher bar in what appears to be random numbers. My only reason to do that is a reminder to myself of when I might apply varnish to the completed piece. I am also fastidious in keeping records of all my work on my computer with backup records too.
Of course, you are living in a digital era. I’m never want to be confused seeing a great print from 70’s confused with a digital reality of today. Increasingly it seems that technical matters define the craft merely to imitate the past- not! I’ve been dating photos for 60 years and my friends usually can’t always tell from the photos when they were created. And, there’s actually 2 dates to record – picture taken +print made.
I agree with no dates. I used to put it on there. But twice now at an art walk in my studio I e sold two older pieces. High end. Had no price or year on them. Thank you for sharing this.
I agree with not placing a date on an item but I do feel that an artist should keep a log or register of the work and when they created it. If there is a need to place the artist’s work into a sequence at some point it can be available. We also have the opportunity of photographing the work so it can be identified easily in the future for publications or retrospectives. Art often is used by designers doing interiors of buildings or homes, they may look at a date and question their choices if they are trying to do a period setting. They may not feel confident in the work but look at the date to see if it fits into their scheme. A museum has folks who understand dating and the progression and look at the date rather than the content of an artist, others may not.
I am a visual artist, photographer and arts administrator
I no longer date my art. I do like the idea of placing a form of the date on the back of the frame. I inventory my art pieces as well.
Any time my work is a candidate for a museum, I’ll be happy to supply dates.
As an artist, I agree with no dates on the art piece, but keeping good records with the date is important, so that it can be looked up if needed.
I used to date my photography on the mat and if a piece didn’t sell right away it became ‘old’ in the buyers eyes and exactly as Jason said the buyer questions what is wrong with it. I have had this happen several time at the beginning of my career and immediately stopped the practice on the piece itself but with Artsala I am able to keep precise records.
You are totally correct on this one Jason. In my 39 years as an art dealer, I have come across multiple instances when the sale of a work of art fell through because the piece was dated. In each instance the customer was concerned that the piece was less desirable because it was dated some time ago. It is difficult for the gallery to explain why it has remained unsold up to the present date. In many instances customers will ask me when a work they are looking at was painted. The public tends to want an artist’s most recent work, for they believe that maturity brings perfection. I don’t like it when my artists date their work, and prefer that they use a code on the back which indicates the timeframe in which it was painted. This makes it all the more important for the artist to catalog their work and maintain a clear record of their work history.
I have sold many pieces and the date didn’t seem to be an issue. However, I do wonder if what you say is true and my work that sits in the gallery may be at a disadvantage because of the date. I appreciate your insight and will stop putting the date on the front of my work. I do wonder should I continue signing the back of my work with the date? I have always done both. Thank you, Penny Winn
I wholeheartedly agree with you Jason. I have often had prize winning paintings that bounced around for years before the “right” collector came along that recognized its merit. A date may or may not have had a bearing on the purchase, but it might have aroused a question in the buyers mind.
Jason, this makes so much sense.
I’ve always thought so, for exactly the same reasons you are giving here. Though a bit ashamed, I must admit subconsciously at times it crosses even my mind when I see an older date.
Being advised by some instructors and professionals in the past I’ve been putting the date on the back of my paintings. But always reluctantly and wondering ‘why’. I keep my own personal records should a need arises to know the date.
Without going in any further detail here, I made an executive decision 😁 ‘no more dates on the back of a paintings’!
You explained your point so well but I would like to hear more from the other side. What’s their reasoning for a ‘must be there’ date on the back?
Thanks!
I agree with other artists that dating for sales purposes is counterproductive. It is not always the newest pieces that sell first during a show but the idea that something very special may not sell for a long time is a difficult concept for most buyers.”Why do I love something that has not sold for years?”
I do not date my larger gallery quality paintings on the front. Occasionally on the back with the copyright designation if I plan to do prints of that image.
I always date my commission work, particularly the portraits as I find it useful to know years later.
After reading all of the responses and arguments for and against dating art work, I might as well jump in. Art work serves purposes that go beyond the monetary gain and that go beyond the life of the artist. For the sake of posterity and the history of the artist’s life, whether just for the family or for the greater public, art work should have a date somewhere on it that will remain there into the future. With regard to people not purchasing art work because it is an older piece that has failed to sell for a decade, for whatever reason(s), I would suggest that a person who does not purchase a work of art because of the length of time it has been for sale probably isn’t the sort of art purchaser a serious artist ought to be that concerned about. Please, no offense to those who think otherwise…but please date your work somewhere on the piece, even it is on the back. A future generation will be grateful.
The only time it seems a date was important was in shows where the stipulation is to enter work done within the previous 2 years. This always seemed arbitrary to me and unnecessary. The watercolor society I belong to does this. And they will not accept your art into a show if it had been accepted into a previous show. (even if it did not receive a prize). The latter reason I guess I can somewhat understand but the former reason makes no sense to me. If the theme of a show or the desires of the artist indicate a fit with an older painting then why can’t it be entered? I will admit that I have foregone entering a show because the piece I wanted to enter was 6 months out on the 2 year deadline imposed. It isn’t that I was not making new work but that it wasn’t ready in my mind for a show. I never date my paintings until it seems that some will never reach a new home or be shown again. Then I date it if I am keeping it for myself just as a reminder.
I agree that the 2 year cutoff is arbitrary. The way I get around that is do more painting on the piece and then it is truthfully finished in the current year.
If you are entering a piece of art in an art show they often say it must be produced during the past so many years even though it has never been shown in that venue. I stopped putting an obvious date on my pieces because of that. I don’t see why a good piece not produced in that particular number of years cannot be entered and judged.
All of my paper pieces are dated & signed on the back . I only sign on the front & the same signature. My paper pieces are framed .. so until it is taken out of frame you can’t see the date.
It’s not just from a sales viewpoint that I don’t put dates on my work, it’s also from an exhibiting perspective . I’m a 79 year old sculptor and printmaker and have been showing for about 50 years. I generally work in series and sometimes slowly. It can take a few years to develop an idea both technically and artistically. Though my work has changed over the years, the work I did 5 or 10 or more years ago is still good. For posterity, I have a very good database with all the information.
I very much resent shows that only want work done in the last 2 years. It’s artificial and it runs counter to how many artists work.
I recently had an exhibition of the work I did on Homelessness in the 1980’s – still relevant and still good work.
Personally, I do not put a date on back. Why? Well sometimes I just forget. But really. I feel like it takes its freedom of why it’s up in display not the how long ago was it painted. If that makes since. If they want to find out ask the painter about the date. If its a problem. I Love your answers to is something wrong with it? I see nothing wrong with not having the date.
I had dated pieces in the past, but agree that it puts a rather arbitrary negative for some potential purchasers. As long as I keep good records of all my paintings, I can tell a buyer of its age, if asked…which I have never been.
I Have Had ‘Unfinished’ Paintings Hanging Around for Sometimes Years.. and Then You Realize What Would Make It Complete…
Perhaps Date of Sale Would be More Appropriate…
Very funny and appreciated.
For my work it depends on whether I’m creating work like a poster or work for posterity.
I agree and have sold older works as new because they are in the ongoing series. But I do often get requests for dates from galleries I am approaching to show work with.
How do you feel about photographs? I put the year next to my signature so people will know when the photo was made. That’s not necessarily when the print was made. Some photographers include both dates, like 2015/2018 for a photo made in 2015 and this print made in 2018. I am a documentary photographer and it is often important or of significant interest to know when a photo was made.
I do not date my art, but I date the month/year it was printed at the bottom left of the print, under the mat. My website notes the month/year that the work was originally produced. I do not see a downside to dating work.
I think it is important to put the copyright sign and the date, i.e, © 2021, beneath the signature to prevent it from being copied.
Our Watercolor Society states paintings must be done within 2 years for our exhibits at the Museum.. This leaves a lot of unsold paintings, so I had an exhibit called “Something Old, Something New,: one old, one new. . And as Challenge Chairman, with a Challenge every 2 months, Every Jan. I have “Make a Silk Purse Out of a Sows Ear” and I find different ways of changing old paintings to be able to be shown within the 2 years period.
. Our Co-op insists that the date must be on the back, if it is not on the front. .Even though many of our artists are always in Splash and win all kinds of Nationally known awards, and sell a lot, they always are in these exhibits.
I ask myself a question: would I rather have an undated Picasso or dated? I’m not sure. Is a dated work by an old or contemporary master bring more value? Is a Gaugan painted in say 1901 better with the date on it?
I’ll be looking further into this interesting question of to date or not to date.
Did Jackson Pollack date his paintings?
I stopped dating my work very early on as some pieces took longer to sell. Unfortunately this was pre pc’s and I have not got everything in one place as now. I did start a catalogue system.
Recently I’ve had a couple of people who have inherited paintings of mine and wanted to know more about them. They are undated on the front. I can remember roughly and tell them about the paintings but can only give a rough date. That’s the only drawback I’ve ever found. I go by how my signature has changed over the years. I wasn’t painting with museums in mind.
One important thing I learned from all your comments is to catalogue my work with the date if I take it seriously. I have been somewhat lax in doing that.
Good advice, and I am going to go back and wipe out the dates on my website.
I’d forgotten.
When we used to hold Open Studios, sometimes a painting would sit quietly as everybody walked by, one, two, three years in a row.
And the fourth year two people would be fighting over it.Thank you.
Even though artists automatically have copyright on their art, if they do not place a copyright notice, which includes a date, they cannot claim the heaviest kinds of damages – which are also the ones that interest an attorney enough to take the case. The copyright notice can, of course, be on the back of the artwork, but it really should be there, date and all. This is completely a separate issue from “dating the art”.
I work in soft pastel, Oil pastel, and when I need a break, watercolor. I never date my work on the front. Due to the fact that soft and oil pastel are fragile mediums, I sign my full name, in perminent ink, on the back of the piece along with a unique serial number that is given to all of my work and logged into my records. The date is part of the serial number. For instance SP2022112501LS, Would be a softpastel, completed on November 25, 2022. The first one completed for that day, and is a landscape. This is also on the back of the piece in ink. Harder to remove if stolen. Where as the initials on the front of the soft pastel can easily be rubbed out and changed. The same is true for oil pastels. So if I am going on that step, why not all of my work, regardless of the medium. Works for me. Makes me feel safer.
I date my work for potential historians however considering my work reflects current events that might be perceived as redundant. And maybe I think too much of my work that historians would appreciate the act of dating. My experience has been that if someone wants a work of art bad enough dates don’t matter because they want what they want.
This is very interesting to me because I never used to date my artwork, but started adding the year to my signature to keep track of the dates — because so many show opportunities will request artwork that is dated within 3-5 years. I suppose I could leave the date off and they might never know — but it also affects looking a a trajectory of progress too. Perhaps dating the artwork less visually (hiding it on the back?) and just not mentioning unless necessary?
I date my artwork always on the back side of my work. (year only) I do this because it is a marker on the year it was created and what my life was at that time. My art changes as I experience life and it is important to remember that time frame both for myself and the collector. I have been homeless and created art, I have had to stay with friends/family to survive and created art and now live in my own apartment and create art. Each timeframe in my life is important to me and the date signifies my art and how it has changed over time. It is like a badge of honor to recognize those dates. Besides as the art world moves closer to adapting digital artworks, each digital copy has it own date in the meta data or blockchain for NFTs.
I date my work only on my website. When I really like a piece it may hang in my home for years before I show it for sale, maybe when I need to change my home display. I avoid publicizing the creation date but if someone asks I’m happy to provide information including when it was finished. The 2 year rule is annoying but it has made me submit pieces that are about to pass their 2 year mark to juried shows and I’m often pleasantly surprised at jurors reactions. I do keep records and would be very honored if a museum ever wanted documentation of my work but the likelihood of that seems remote.
I’m fine with Jason’s idea of not putting dates on my artworks for commercial reasons.
I’ve been in the United States for two months now,busy focused in the studio painting and following couching lessons from Jason on how to organize my artworks for business.
My United States series has a story behind and I think I will date the collection without dating each painting.
Sign your work or not, depends on the author. But museum directors also have the right to demand truthful and accurate information about the work they purchased.
It’s like a person’s passport – everything must be true and accurate.
I would add that a work of art is the only product that increases in value over time. If the painting is in excellent condition even after 5 or 10 years, this is a big asset, not a disadvantage. Of course, I admit that sometimes you can change both the title and the date of creation of the picture, but this is more of a necessity and an exception, not a hard law!
My experience is also interesting: I have never sold new, fresh work. As soon as I start a new period, so clients start buying the work of the previous period!
I responded with a comment. Hopefully, it catches on. Master Artist ScottJPeradotto.
I totally agree and now leave the date off my work but include it in my archival portfolio. I found that many of my works were not allowed to be included in art exhibitions simply because of the dates not being within a year or two, even though they have never been shown before. So, without a date I can enter exhibitions based on the quality of the work. This works for me because I am constantly creating new works of art each year. I don’t think anyone would turn down a Picasso because it is old! Art without a date can be viewed for the work without bias.
I will occasionally put an older painting back on my easel and make changes to it. If I had dated it, would you expect me to add the revision date to the work? This is not as unusual as someone may think. Ask Leonardo (di Vinci, not di Caprio…). In fact, I just had a painting selected to a juried competition and I made changes AFTER it was selected. Since I am the artist, isn’t it up to me to decide when the work is finally finished?
If you don’t care about ever selling your work and just want it to land in a museum, I agree with the museum guy. And chances are that it would be rejected for being too old unless it’s an old master.
If you want to sell your work, YOU are correct. Date matters because, yes, buyers think that a work has been on the market for all those years when that’s not necessarily the case. For example, I have several pieces that I’ve had stored or on my own wall going back over 10 years. One in particular has gotten a lot of attention over the years and I believe that the age of the piece is irrelevent to the value. But that presumption keeps me from putting it on the market. I’ll die with my hands holding it.
All useful comments, but the takeaway for me is this from Jason’s note to the museum director:
“It’s not that there is anything wrong with the artwork, it simply takes time to align the art with the right individual who will be willing and able to make the purchase.”
Such encouraging words for us all.
Thank you, Jason
While I do understand an archivist’s point of view, I discontinued using dates on my work long ago for the very reasons Jason states. In my experience it’s a practice which hurts the artist and the sale. Being “dated” carries all sorts of negative notes. If it’s not present it doesn’t become a focus of consideration for a buyer.
I do however keep a database of every artwork I complete. It includes a unique catalog number from a system I designed, dates, photos, media, size, description, title and more.
On my task list: making sure the database is available when I’m no longer around – hopefully in a distant future.
Thank you Jason, for doing all this work in supporting artists.
I date my work for personal reasons mostly, so I can know and remember when something was done. I’m jumping from one theme and style to the next and it is easy for me to forget when a particular thing was made. I do smaller series, and still have not landed a solid style which I would want to reproduce in larger numbers and in better quality. So… mostly experiments, lots of them.
I’m an analog person who does not have a lot of trust in electronic records, or even analog records separate from the piece. Computers crash (happened to me), files get corrupted, notes get misplaced. Information on the back (or front) of the piece is always there.
I understand the argument of not dating for actively selling artists, but it does not apply to me, as I accumulate, not sell. In outdoor art and public installations this question hardly matters. In my experimental studio pieces, I date them, and sometimes even make notes on the back about nature of the piece or what it meant to me, so it is not grossly misinterpreted in the future.
Museum guys come from their own perspective, but who promised their work will be easy? Living artists have to support themselves, and only a handful will be represented in the museums in some distant future. If it affects the sales, it is a reason enough not to do it, or at least not to emphasize it in any way.
On the international art fairs such as Figment, or Armory one may see a much older piece by a famous well collected international artist, where older date gives it even more value, as it is a rare collectible piece. So… until one has reached international level of being collected and displayed by the Gagosians of the day – one probably should not worry about dating their work (maybe only for copyright and legal reason, as pointed in one of the comments).
Jason – beautiful poppy painting that you are using at the top of the article. Where is attribution to the artist? Or is it AI? Either way, saying so would be appreciated.
I’ve dated, titled and signed my work from the beginning. Showing the development of where the “seeds” of my art began and hopefully the blooms developed or are going. Life keeps moving. It is frustrating when opportunities set limits to most recent dates only when a piece of art from the past might fit the said theme. Perhaps no dates is the way to go while keeping strict records. For me it is conviction, commitment to my vision. How that works in the business of art may be another story.
Do you feel this is the same with bronze sculptures? I started sculpting early 2000 but it was harder to get exposure back then and with a day job and family my art was not at the top of my list. Now I’m dedicated to my sculpting and marketing, but I do wonder if the dates come into question by collectors. But I’ve also notice that my buyers do not inquire about the dates. I’ve only recently gained some gallery representations and I’m curious if this will be an issue.